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FTR#1279 This program was recorded in one, 60-minute segment.
FTR#1280 This program was recorded in one, 60-minute segment.
Introduction: Our ongoing series of interviews with Jim DiEugenio–selected by Oliver Stone to write the screenplay for the documentary JFK Revisited and to write and edit the book derived from the film—presents an extremely enriching guest, John Newman.
Author of among other titles JFK and Vietnam and Oswald and the CIA, John was deeply involved with Stone’s 1991 opus JFK.
The interviews begin with review of topics previously discussed in this FTR series, including: President Eisenhower’s order to kill Patrice Lumumba of the Congo, reaching a crescendo with Ike’s outburst at a national security meeting demanding aloud Lumumba’s termination; Presidents Trump’s and Biden’s balking at the mandated release of documents pursuant to the ARRB’s mandate; discussion of Operation Northwoods, Lyman Lemnitzer’s and Maxwell Taylor’s planned series of provocations designed to provoke a U.S. invasion of Cuba.
Of particular note is John Newman’s disclosure that no recordings of the meetings of the Joint Chiefs of Staff have survived intact!
1. Next, we review JFK’s Vietnam policy (this, too, has been covered in past talks, however we present added depth drawing on John’s expertise and published book JFK and Vietnam.)
Key Points of Discussion and Analysis Include: 9 different suggestions presented to JFK in 1961 to send U.S. troops into Vietnam; JFK’s reluctance to put troops in Cuba and Vietnam due, in part, to the U.S. not having sufficient forces available in case of a flareup of tensions in Europe; MacArthur and DeGaulle’s advice against sending American combat troops into Vietnam; Drafting of NSAM 111 in November of 1963, committing the U.S. to “helping the Vietnamese” but avoiding an open-ended commitment including the use of American combat units; John Kenneth Galbraith’s fact-finding mission to Saigon to obtain independent analysis for JFK; McNamara/Maxwell Taylor’s Saigon trip and subsequent recommendations to JFK to escalate the war; JFK’s rebuttal—he wanted a full withdrawal to begin; RFK’s central position in JFK’s Vietnam policy; JFK’s leaking of intention to withdraw from Vietnam, which eventually reached the press; NSAM 263 and its formal codification of JFK’s withdrawal policy; The of NSAM 263 to JFK’s “secret” disclosure of the withdrawal plan; Bundy’s draft of NSAM 273; Subsequent revisions of NSAM 273 in the direction of escalation; LBJ’s rubber stamping of what Maxwell Taylor wanted; Review of LBJ’s duplicity during 1964 campaign—Operation Rolling Thunder, sea-borne raids on North, Gulf of Tonkin incident/Resolution had all been planned even as LBJ was campaigning on a pledge not to send U.S. troops to Vietnam; The fact that NSAM 273 being crafted on 11/24/1963, the day Ruby shoots Oswald.
2. We then highlight General Curtis LeMay’s attitude toward and behavior with regard to JFK.
Key Points of Discussion and Analysis Include: Le May’s 11/22/1963 hunting trip to Canada (misrepresented as being in Michigan); Orders given to LeMay to land at Andrews AFB; LeMay’s landing at D.C. airport instead; Commander Humes smells cigar smoke at Bethesda autopsy and orders Navy corpsman to tell smoker to put it out; Smoker is LeMay, who blows smoke into corpsman’s face.
3. Discussion concludes with what Senator Richard Schweiker noted: that there were “the fingerprints of Intelligence all around Oswald.” An important consideration bracketing this discussion concerns the CIA’s counterintelligence search/obsession for a KGB mole within the Agency. John has written, and is writing, about that subject. Oswald’s “defection” to the USSR overlapped that dynamic.
Key Points of Discussion and Analysis Include: Review of State Department official Otto Otepka and his interest in Oswald; Review of treatment Otepka received, including Otepka’s dismissal on 11/5/1963; Detailed review of Oswald’s 201 file; Discussion of what a 201 is and the extraordinarily unusual circumstances surrounding Oswald’s 201; Oswald’s threat to reveal classified info, other communications–information that should have led to creation of a 201 file but did not; CIA official Bagley & British intelligence veteran Anthony Blunt’s discussion about Oswald being a “witting” defector; Detailed discussion of a counterintelligence gambit involving Oswald, “defectors” to the Soviet Union and the storied CIA counterintelligence search for a KGB “mole;” CIA was keeping track of Oswald for four years prior to assassination and were getting info up to one week before; Fir Play for Cuba Committee was created at the same time as Eisenhower ordered the overthrow of Castro; Review of Oswald, Guy Banister and FPCC; Oswald spying on student leftists for Banister; An FBI special agent was going to include info about 544 Camp Street but scratched it out before sending to Bureau HQ; FBI doesn’t ask Banister about Oswald when the interview him (Banister was a former FBI agent); Discussion of Flash Notice on Oswald’s files at CIA and FBI; FBI’s Marvin Gheesling takes it off Oswald’s FBI file in October ’63; Significance of this action vis a vis Oswald’s 201 file.
NB: The kfjc.org website is down, probably because of the weather. It should be up again, presently. That is why the audio files are–temporarily–unresponsive. Again, the problem will disappear, as soon as the kfjc.org website is back up again.
interview 1279 still doesnt work with pop up or other way; pls fi
See the notation at the upper right of the front page.
1961 was the year Patrice Lamumba was assassinated, which kicked off a lot of exposés on the so-called “Cold” War.
Everything is back online. Looking forward to listening to both of these tonight!
Dave your back and that is good we happen to be in Rome